00:00:00] Tiffanie: we've all heard of 9 88, the suicide and crisis line. But who knows that there's actually another hotline that you can call in case somebody is thinking about doing a mass shooting.

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[00:00:24] Tiffanie: What if the darkest chapters of your life could become someone else's survival guide? I'm Tiffany, survivor, storyteller and host of True Crime Connections, where we turn pain in the power and stories in the Sparks of Hope.

[00:00:37] Every week I sit down with someone who's lived through the unimaginable and found the streak. And found the strength to speak out. This week I am joined with Sean Conone. He operates the Mass Shooting Prevention Crisis Center Hotline. That is a mouthful. Welcome.

[00:00:59] SEAN CONONIE : We say the rage hotline or the, you know, no shoot line or whatever.

[00:01:05] Tiffanie: Gotcha. This is amazing. I had no idea that this was even a thing.

[00:01:12] SEAN CONONIE : Either did we, we put it together so fast. Uh, our normal line of business is homeless shelter shelters, and we obviously deescalate a lot of suicides, a lot of violent, um, things that are happening. And overnight I'm like, you know, this is ridiculous. You see the parents [00:01:30] crying like, let's do something. So within a couple months we got it off the ground.

[00:01:35] Tiffanie: Oh wow. How many calls do you think, like, would you say that you guys get.

[00:01:40] SEAN CONONIE : Well, the good thing is we hope not to get a lot of calls because then it's a major problem. So we're, we're gonna be getting that one call that if it's a real time, , like a school shooting, the person's about to go in, maybe they're thinking maybe not. So we're not gonna get a lot of calls. Now, we may get some that, that we, we call that a hot call. get some calls saying, look, I'm, I'm being bullied at school. Stuff like that. we get a lot of electronic communication. We've had a few calls so far, , but more electronic communications than the new thing.

[00:02:14] Tiffanie: Right, and obviously these calls are just as serious as if somebody was calling the 9 88 suicide line. So these people are thinking about doing. Harm to others.

[00:02:26] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah. You know, these people are suicidal like in 90% of the time, so you, and they crash like two months before the actual mass casualty event. That's what we're kind say now because. Now they're using cars, knives, whatever. So, , we, we gotta say match casualty event, but, , planning in that period.

[00:02:47] They usually have trauma already in their life. They've had past trauma, it wasn't addressed. And then more trauma hits them. In that two month period, on doing something very violent, and there's [00:03:00] usually what we call leakage. that two month period, they're telling somebody that they're gonna do something bad. People just gotta catch it. People gotta listen.

[00:03:11] Tiffanie: I had a guest on my show and he was talking about that very topic, but he says, don't just hear it. Listen, or I know, I think he said, don't just listen, like, hear it. Hear what these people are telling you. If they're sitting here and throwing out threats, don't just automatically be like, oh, they're venting.

[00:03:29] Or you know, like you don't just write it off automatically. Like this could be a real thing. So don't just listen, hear it.

[00:03:39] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah. And if you know the person and you're on good terms, so you can sit there and say, Hey, are these real feelings? Well, why don't we get you some help? You know, let's see if we can help you in some way. You know, people love you. People want you around. We don't want you to hurt yourself and hurt other people that you can kind of venture to do based on how violent you think they are. if you hear a stranger say it or somebody you barely know. Well, I report that to the police and let them know what's going on you know, they may have to do an investigation, especially if everything is serious. Unfortunately, of kids at school say things that they don't mean, but we, you know, when they're finding like 90 some percent of these people say they're gonna do it. And that's the sad part because our law enforcement cleared them [00:04:30] there's so many calls. Law enforcement always has the time to do, , follow ups. Now, what we're doing, follow ups, if we get a call and we tell 'em to get services or we, we tell 'em how to get services or where to go, we're gonna continually follow up.

[00:04:42] Like on a workplace violence call that we did get electronic communication. Actually, we still follow up, follow up with him, and he's for the last nine months, you know, I send 'em up texts all the time. Hey, you're doing all right. How's your stress level so forth.

[00:04:59] Tiffanie: That's good. So they don't feel like they just be. Been kind of thrown to the side and forgotten about.

[00:05:03] SEAN CONONIE : Unfortunately, , we have a lot of that and, , you know, people say, when people say defund the police, it means to get rid of cops, which it doesn't mean to get rid of cops. It means to maybe use law enforcement in a different way. As in, you know, in Florida we have the Mental Health Act of Baker Act. departments have Baker Act squads that are really trained. On how to deal with a person like that. And some departments don't have it all and they go to a mental health call and then there's a shooting. So it's all about approach and all about training and deescalation, no matter what kind of call it is. So nobody really wants to get rid of cops. The Democrats don't wanna get rid of cops, you know, they say they do, but they don't. .

[00:05:43] Tiffanie: I

[00:05:46] mess.

[00:05:48] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah. Yeah. They just wanna, you know, it's, it's good to have, like, now they're finding out that the homeless outreach teams, , let's, St. Pete has a program, but the cops are doing homeless outreach and they bring a homeless [00:06:00] person or a caseworker with them, and they work together, and it seems to be doing very well.

[00:06:05] Tiffanie: Good. That's very good. I did watch the video on your website with Aaron Stark and that was eye-opening and I actually applaud him for owning up to, he didn't care who he was, taken out. He was pissed, he was hurt, and he wanted other people to suffer just like he did. And it was like, wow, to actually be able to own that.

[00:06:30] Is empowering and to fix it and stop yourself.

[00:06:34] SEAN CONONIE : And an act of kindness stopped him. So that's why we, we put that website. We wanted to make our website so simple. Not all this data and all this crap, just, hey, slow down. These thoughts are temporary. We can get you through it. You can get it through yourself. Watch the video and get some help, and people love you.

[00:06:54] That's, you know, we made it very simple that could understand it.

[00:06:59] Tiffanie: Yeah, and I like that you put on there. It's almost kind of like put. Yourself in these people's shoes. Like how would you feel if someone shot your family member? You know, just because they were mad at the world. And I think hopefully that would make people think. And if anybody is interested, just so you know, the website is www dot 6 0 5, no shoot,

[00:07:22] SEAN CONONIE : 6 0

[00:07:22] Tiffanie: which is also the phone number.

[00:07:23] SEAN CONONIE : , Www, six oh five-no-shoot.org. But we

[00:07:29] Tiffanie: Yes.

[00:07:29] SEAN CONONIE : now, [00:07:30] we made it simple though, , www mass shooting.org. So that's another one. It directs him to that page.

[00:07:40] Tiffanie: I was literally looking at the dashes and why I didn't say them. I.

[00:07:47] SEAN CONONIE : So, , this work? I don't know. And I'll tell you a little bit about after we had established the line, we started to look at research and all these college professors are saying, Hey, there needs to be some rage. or some way for these people to deescalate and they, they were paid bucks to do this research.

[00:08:07] Not one of them started it. Sad enough, we had reached out to them saying, Hey, we're gonna start this rage hotline, or we had started it and we want your input. We want your help. Not one person got back to us. You know, they did all the

[00:08:22] Tiffanie: Wow.

[00:08:23] SEAN CONONIE : You know, we wanna help but not one person, you know, you know, and we sent it right to their educational website.

[00:08:29] You know, their email for the college institution kind of really made me feel really bad. You know, I don't charge people who wanna open up small homeless shelters, a mom and pop shop. I don't charge 'em for my advice. I do what I do to help them out.

[00:08:45] Tiffanie: Right, right. That's eyeopening that they would spend all this money in research and then not even really want to have to do. Anything with a solution that's being presented.

[00:08:56] SEAN CONONIE : I think they knew that phone mines wouldn't ring all the time and it was gonna be very [00:09:00] expensive. But we're able to combine agencies and like when we're doing work for the homeless agency, we have our hotline right to us, so we can do that as well. So it doesn't cost us extra money. We figured out how to do it economically. And then when we leave, like today at a doctor's appointment, I bring three phones with me. So, you know, we can't answer them if we're on the run. I then, , when I go to a hotel or something like that, I have a whole switchboard I bring with me

[00:09:28] Tiffanie: Oh wow.

[00:09:29] SEAN CONONIE : We have a regular, like a, like a, looks like a landline phone for the car and for the RV for our crisis units.

[00:09:37] Tiffanie: How many people do you have answering phones?

[00:09:40] SEAN CONONIE : 1, 2, 3, 4. Right now

[00:09:44] Tiffanie: Gotcha.

[00:09:45] SEAN CONONIE : for me, my bedroom has a switchboard right next to my bed. then if that goes down for some unknown reason, I have two cellular backups. And then of course we keep a generator and we have all the networks, all the internet providers. So if one goes down, we can get another one will jump to that internet provider. We don't wanna

[00:10:03] Tiffanie: Okay. Right. I mean that could be your, your only hope to stopping whatever might be happening. Do you have to have any like kind of certification or anything to like answer these calls?

[00:10:15] SEAN CONONIE : No, we, we all are pretty strong on how we deescalated in the past. We got some training from some SWAT teams because like if a shooter does call us and we do talk them down, and it's an active shooter about to be. We're gonna tell them what to expect, okay? The [00:10:30] cops are gonna come at you. They're gonna have the guns pointing at you, you know, , if you have a jacket on, take it off. You know, put your gun far away from where you are When you see the cops pull up, lay on the ground, you know, and expect lights and sirens and loud noises and people shouting, shouting at you for, you know, all that stuff. We, so we want them to know, we wanna keep the cops safe and all to see the shooter safe. Because that's the idea of the thing is to keep everybody safe.

[00:10:58] Tiffanie: Right. Everybody wants to go home.

[00:11:00] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah,

[00:11:03] Tiffanie: I think this is an amazing idea. I love it. And that's why I was like, oh yeah, we gotta talk about this on the show. Just so other people are aware, is this gonna be like nationally, like any it, does it matter where you live?

[00:11:15] SEAN CONONIE : It's actually in the all United States and parts of Canada. Incidentally, we get a hot call in action, real time, call our nine one one happens to be in Canada because they had better capabilities in the USA to transfer to me police department in America and Matter out of seconds. Yeah, it's called Northern 9 1 1. , We pay for that service and they're fast. So if we get a call in Kentucky we know where the guy is and he's talking to us, I could say, connect me to this city in Kentucky. Boom. And I put it right through.

[00:11:52] Tiffanie: Very interesting.

[00:11:54] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, they called him PSAPs. I think it was like 5,500 or 6,500 in America. But Canman really [00:12:00] did good on this.

[00:12:03] Tiffanie: That's amazing. I mean, I'm just really thankful that there are resources out here like this. 'cause there's so many people with mental health issues, drug problems, you know, just people who are sick of their lives and don't care who they're hurting on their way out. So the fact that there's resources to help people talk them down.

[00:12:22] Maybe try to get them some help is very, very important and it's pivotal.

[00:12:26] SEAN CONONIE : You know when you just said that, it makes me think, when I used to see these shootings on tv, I would be cussing out and the person who did it, calling them evil pieces of crap scumbags. How dare you take a child away from a parent? the Okay. It's like the worst thing in the world you could possibly do. And then when you look at it and see that these people have been through the system and they're not just getting the proper help. they're in a mental health crisis state. I don't think they're as evil as we think they are. So, you know, we don't wanna be punitive if people, if people call us up, we don't wanna say you're gonna go to jail, because that's not the, no, we wanna give them services. If we have a shooter and he doesn't want to put his gun down and we know where we are and you know where he is and he's about to a shooting, we're gonna call law enforcement, ASAP. know, to try to get the cops there faster or whatever. Maybe they can approach 'em. but the main thing is to be non-punitive. , And non, you know, not, don't get 'em arrested, but [00:13:30] more of a mental health act, , to, you know, keep everybody safe.

[00:13:35] Tiffanie: Do you have a way to see like their exact location?

[00:13:38] SEAN CONONIE : , We can use some technology that's available, if they, you know, we tell them in our TikTok promotional stuff, get, if you're afraid to call, go out and buy a burner phone. I don't wanna know who you are. If you don't want me, me to know. All I wanna do is help you. And we wanna keep that true. But if we either, if they do call, they don't block their number, and we did locate them, and they're not gonna put the gun down and they're gonna shoot them out of seconds, we're gonna, you know, obviously we're gonna call law enforcement, but if someone really wants to talk, we wanna be there for them.

[00:14:12] And we don't wanna know who they are. We wanna help them. And that's it. I, I tell 'em all the time, get a burner phone. You know what to call us. We're here to help you.

[00:14:22] Tiffanie: Right.

[00:14:23] SEAN CONONIE : And there's a couple different calls, you know, people can be radicalized online, you know, and become a terrorist. And maybe they were thinking, maybe I shouldn't do this.

[00:14:33] Maybe it's wrong. We, we have tried to appeal to those people. obviously school shooters. We, we do some tiktoks and Twitter on, , the, the game sites. , We've asked the NRA multitude of times. , I, I got an NR 15, I'm an NRA member and I'm a Democrat, so we, you know, but I, I don't believe guns is always what does it, health is probably what does it, and we ask the NA can't you put our flyer and all your material?

[00:14:59] We're not [00:15:00] after to stop guns. We're not against the NRA, we're, we want people that need help that are crashing to get help and they, they don't even get back to us. It really shocks me. they always say, it's not the guns, it's the person. Well put your money where your mouth is in. All right. You know, I'm not asking for money.

[00:15:18] I'm asking you to put our information out in, in your literature.

[00:15:24] Tiffanie: I mean, what farm is it going to do? You're not telling them they can't. Have the gun, but if you get the gun, something sets you off and you're like, oh shit, you have a backup. You have something to do. And you would think that all these different players would wanna help with such an important thing. It's just mind blowing how some of these companies work.

[00:15:46] It really is.

[00:15:47] SEAN CONONIE : And you know, basically a mass shooting every day in America. Most people don't understand that, a lot of these shootings are. Maybe a disturbance at a nightclub or disturbance at a field. you know that is gonna happen based on people's anger right then and there. They're probably not gonna call but somebody who can talk to them.

[00:16:07] If they see them with a gun, who could deescalate them, that may help that person. But we're after the people that are planning like a, I'm just gonna kill whoever, mass shooting. run over 50 people. I want to hit a bus stop at a school tho. Those are things we're after, but the every day. you that we get in America. You know, there's not much you can do there on our [00:16:30] side. We just wanna be one of the tools in the toolbox to make a child safe so they go home and don't destroy their life. Most of these incidences, a lot of families become homeless over this issue. And that was my first for the research like 20 years ago. Wow. The parents gotta get divorced. It has to and usually they get divorced, a lot of them. And then some of them end up homeless. So that's when I first got interested in mass shootings.

[00:16:56] Tiffanie: And it's sad. It really is. And it's, again, it's, it's preventable.

[00:17:02] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, we gotta do something more has to be done

[00:17:06] Tiffanie: Yeah, for sure.

[00:17:08] SEAN CONONIE : without reaching the right people in think tanks. see what else could be done. You know, I had thought, well, maybe when someone buys an AR 15, maybe there should be a mall in Florida you can buy the gun. But two law enforcement officers come for a second, go to the gun shop, say, Hey, we're not interfering with you buying the gun, but we're just asking you, is everything okay? Are you having any problems? Can we get you help? That alone may be a good tool to put in the toolbox, but. I don't know. I don't see it happening.

[00:17:44] Tiffanie: Right. Like, what do you need it for? I mean, I, I know some people aren't gonna wanna be like, oh, well I need it for the, you know what I mean, because privacy and everything, but we just wanna make sure that you're not doing it to hunt people.

[00:17:57] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, exactly. And , you know, that's. [00:18:00] You gotta, you know, they're gonna get a permit in most cases. So that's public information. I don't know if they're regular, like on shotguns, if that's reported to data banks or other public information. But just simply have it two good cops to go there and say, man, you are right. I don't wanna know why you wanna do want the gun. It's not my business. I just wanna know if you're okay. You know? That's it. It may, the guy may say, no, I wanna kill someone. I wanna go shoot some people. 'cause I'm fucked up in the head and I wanna died too. So that alone may help.

[00:18:38] Tiffanie: No, I think there's a lot of different things they can do. The time. When they took away that you don't need to have the caring permit, I was like, what in the fuck are you doing? Like we have a huge problem out here. And I understand they say it's not the people who have them legally that are doing this.

[00:18:57] It's the people who get them illegally. But I'm like, no, still you should have to take a class. You should have to know how to operate it. Like these are just things you should have to do.

[00:19:10] SEAN CONONIE : I know 20 years, or maybe 30 years ago when I got my CCF and my concealed firearms permit, we had to go take a class. , Byer County Police Academy gave a class and it was a good class on safety, but I think they need to be a little bit longer. And, I, I haven't carried a gun. had a policy. If there was somebody violent at the [00:19:30] shelter, what would we do?

[00:19:31] We had an active shooter policy and so forth. , We never had anything like that occur, if you have a policy in place, okay, I'm, I'm lost here in words. Lemme go back. You gonna have to edit this part out. oh God. You know, when you get over 61, these things happen to you.

[00:19:56] Tiffanie: Uh, I'm 45 and they happen to me.

[00:20:01] SEAN CONONIE : So anyway, , you know, you get your permit, whatever, and you, you have your gun. It, when do you use it? And it's very important and how do you use it? But I haven't carried a gun. at, sure, at the shelter. We had some incidents where I thought, you know, the guy had a weapon or whatever, but now I don't leave the house without a weapon because you're bound to run into something these days, which is sad. You know, you go to the movie theater, know your exits, look where your exits are, and your every family should have a plan. Hey, if something happens in here. This is what we do. You go to a restaurant, where are the exits? What do you do if you, you know, if an active shooter comes up to you and you're at a, you know, at a doctor's office for se, do you do? You know, and you know, you run, you hide or you fight as the last resort. People need to know that, you know now.

[00:20:59] Tiffanie: It's just sad [00:21:00] that that's where we've gotten to like kick. Go to concerts, movies, freaking the hospital. I mean, just nowhere is safe anymore.

[00:21:11] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, now they're at least using private security with weapons. For years, the hospitals who had private security didn't have any firearms. Now you see them with firearms. You get ex-military guys and so forth that take these jobs that may save some lives, and it has saved some lives actually.

[00:21:29] Tiffanie: Well, good. If anyone who's not watching this on YouTube, just so you know, the phone number is six oh five. 6, 6, 7, 4, 6, 6 8, and that's 24 hours a day, seven days a week. So that is good stuff right there and poor you by your bed. But I love it and it's needed. It shows you care.

[00:21:56] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah. Where's my phone bag? My phone back. So when I go, we go out, like at a doctor's appointment, me and my administrative assistant who is very helpful, she, we go out, we have a bag full of phones, you know, we can answer right then and there. 'cause I do leave the office sometimes. So, and you know, I can put three phones in here, networks.

[00:22:18] Tiffanie: Oh my gosh. Well, I commend you. I do. I mean, it's a 24 hour job and. You do it out of the kindness of your own heart, and I think that's amazing. [00:22:30] And I know , your, , website also takes donations. So anybody who is wanting to donate to this wonderful cause, please do so there. I'm gonna make sure I have the phone number and the links to your website in the show notes.

[00:22:41] SEAN CONONIE : We also, uh, the end of August, we're releasing a song called, I Should have Gotten Help with a young, talented singer, Lily Target. , She's up and coming and, , it's a really good song. Basically what happens is. , She becomes, she's a victim. She dies. She's in line up in heaven waiting to see the big guy. sees the shooter, they argue it out in heaven, and then the end result was they say, you should have gotten help. He says, I, I should have gotten help. She says, you should have gotten help. So the answer is, get help. If you have these feelings, get help. It, it, it will help You will end up living and not dying, and you won't hurt people.

[00:23:21] Tiffanie: Right, or you won't end up spending the rest of your life. Jail. So just don't do it. It's like they say drugs are bad, guns are bad. Well, if you're gonna use them in bad ways, so let's, let's put that out there.

[00:23:35] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, we're excited about the song because it's really, really good and , of like on it that it's real, you know, it's real, it's happening, and it didn't have to happen.

[00:23:47] Tiffanie: Right? It's preventable. 110%. It's preventable. Anything else you wanted to add?

[00:23:55] SEAN CONONIE : I think we're good. , I think for your viewers, listen, it's important for you to know [00:24:00] what to do and when you're out, know your exits. where to take you and your family. Tell your family, even your kids what to do. Your kids may tell you what to do nowadays, your toddler, , 'cause of these, you know, these drills they have, but you know, you run.

[00:24:15] If shots fired, you run. If you can't run, you hide. Go in a room, barricade the door a last resort, you fight like hell. Fire extinguishers meant good weapons, you know? You know, whatever you could do to slow up the time the shooter gets to you gives more time for law enforcement to get to you unless you're in Texas.

[00:24:34] Of course, that was a bad thing that happened at that school.

[00:24:40] Tiffanie: Yes.

[00:24:40] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, it was, , that day I was watching a lot, the video of him in the school, , when I put aired it, and I'm screaming at him, calling him every name in the book, then I went from him to the cops like, what the hell are you doing? You know? , Last active shooters, you go, you go in and that's hard to say, you know, it's a hard thing to do to run towards somebody with an AR 15, but. That was utterly ridiculous, and I still don't know what happened. Some, you know, these cops, a lot of them are beta guys, and Albert we know, maybe Alpha, I don't know whatever it's called, but they, they liked this action. They wanted to go in, you know, they were told they couldn't.

[00:25:20] Tiffanie: Yeah, sometimes that stuff gets really sticky because it's also for their own safety. But at the same time, it's like you can't, can't help people if you [00:25:30] can't get in kind of the same thing, like, you know, when somebody needs to go to the hospital and they're, they're hurt. And if they're not really sure how the scene is, they can't even send an ambulance for the person to get help because they don't know how the rest of the scene is.

[00:25:44] And I was just gonna say, I mean, somebody might die when the ambulance is sitting right there, but they can't come near.

[00:25:53] SEAN CONONIE : Well now they're letting these, , specially trained EMS workers and firemen. , They have a vests for them. They're trained to go into an active shooter, and, and start because we, we held back aid for a while and the bleed, especially with the damage of an R 15 round, you know, they really, really caused the person, person to bleed. So bleeding kits are very important in schools. Everybody should have to be at home for even injuries. But now the, the, the especially trained people go in and start treating people as they're still looking for the shooter. lot of this new training that they're doing, either they should put cops there instead of the EMS workers and train the cop to be an EMS worker instead of just taking an e em, s worker in there, maybe who can't, is not armed or whatever. But you know, that's me.

[00:26:39] Tiffanie: Right, right. There's just so many tweaks that could be made. Well, I wanna thank you so much for being on the show, and anyone who needs to share this with somebody, please do. The more awareness we have, the less crap we have to deal with. Like, let's nip this shit in the [00:27:00] ass.

[00:27:00] SEAN CONONIE : Yeah, it's getting bad and it's gonna be worse as

[00:27:04] Tiffanie: Right.

[00:27:05] SEAN CONONIE : occurs around the country.

[00:27:07] Tiffanie: Unfortunately, yes. Well, thank you so much.

[00:27:12] SEAN CONONIE : Thank you and thanks for having

[00:27:14] Speaker: If this story moved, you share with someone who needs to hear it. Don't forget to follow, rate and review. It helps more survivors find our community. Do you wanna be part of the conversation and share your story? Visit true crime connections.com. Until next time, be safe, be seen, and never forget. Your story has power.